How did you first become interested in Classical Music?

- See, strictly I belong to a musical family. My father was a musician, Shri.Devesa Bhagavathar as, he was known. My grandfather was a musician, Shri.Venkateshwara Bhagavathar, popularly known as "Venkicha Bhagavathar" and my paternal uncle was also a Vainika. My father played violin and had a beautiful voice, and also sang, and that is the formation which gave me a very staunch instinct to take up music.

And, your father actually taught music to you?

- Of course, I had a very strong instinct and I insisted my father, though he did not very much like to exert myself and all that, he wanted me to take studies; those people believed in studies because they taught music might be very tedious in future; He told me "why Music? .. you sing for yourself" ; Anyway I wanted serious coaching, then he began & by the age of 10 or so, I used to sing a few kritis only, but Ragam, Swaram and all those things, came almost naturally by Lakshya.

Did you begin by singing for weddings, when you were very young?

- weddings?? No .. some temples and private parties during my school days and later that too I stopped ; my father stopped, not to have unnecccessary exhibitions of small boy, he wanted to get me matured later;

He wanted you to be an engineer or what field…?

- some sort of general education and enter some office, because he didn't have much education in those days., so he was enarmoured of education, office and all that; but anyhow I had my high school days & college days. When I finished my graduation in Victoria College, even then, my father did not want me to take music though I had come to a very decent level; able to perform for a couple of hours and more.I used to perform in Tyagaraja festivals during my college days. Chembai Vaidyanatha Bhagavathar, Anna… and all those musicians were interested in me. They wanted me to even become their disciples but somehow or the other I had my own view that I should have a bit of modern approach to things as well as the traditional way of musical life and studentship, to get a very orthodox, traditional and scientific understanding of things, It was a bit of dream, I can say, but somehow or the other it came to fusion when I was thinking seriously like that; They started in Kalakshetra, Rukmini Devi with my master.

You came to Madras to actually study music?

- I came to Madras to have a very serious course of music and a very strong personal touch of things.

But, you already had gotten your BA in Science? In what field was it?

- yes I finshed, in Physics. I was a Physics Student and then I came to Kalakshetra and naturally they started this Sangita Shiromani Course. I was the only student. My master was here, after Anamalai University, he came here.

Had you heard of Tiger before? Had you heard him sing or teach?

- I had heard about his name, when people, my father and musicians used to say, "Ohh this is a great musician, who is rather a musician of musicians and people should hear his music, though he was not actually for a platform musician type, he was an authority in music, so on and so forth they used to talk sometimes. So, I had only hearsay of things and it was my good fortune and privilege to come like this, to be very close to him for a number of years like that, very close to him and of course Kalakshetra atmosphere and all that, it was very very natural..

You were together everyday, I think?

- almost together, though I lived with my parents; my parents used to follow me like anything, my high school days, my college days, Kalakshetra life ..

You were their only son, weren't you?

- yes I am the only son, four or five children died very young, myself and my only sister survived, naturally my parents were very much attached to me, so they followed me like anything; so even in Adyar, I was in the neighbouring village, next street, we used to live in that house .. we were there..

You mean where the Theosphical Society is now?

- It was a society quarters, infact they gave me as a student a very very nominal rent and all that.. they were considerate because I was a very qualified student. They were very watchful about my progress, Rukmini Devi and all those seniors were vey much interested.

It was like a close family?

- Yes a close family .. and my master also developed sort of father and son relationship, naturally I also had a parental regard and much more . and he knew from the very beginning and infact his type of music, though he had innumerable students in the Music Academy, Madras University & Annamalai University, nobody could ever go near his style.. all simply gazed at him and simply paid tribute.

He had a very unusual style then?

- Yes, unusual style..

No one could imitate him?

- very unusual style, very individualistic. It required a lot assimilation and observation and a type of voice it required.

He paid a lot of attention to the words of the songs, I think?

- ofcourse, he knew almost half a dozen languages Sanskrit, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, very fine English also and had a very fine background of things; apart from the word meaning and all that, he went into the central bhava of the composer "Kavi Hrudaya" poet's mind, as he called it. So, he had a very high sense of sensitiveness and approach to things and that made his music very very subtle, when he rendered compositions. technicalities like ragas, swara singing and thanam by himself, he was also inimitable. So, in those days, great musicians, his contemporaries, seniors, Muthiah Bhagavathar, Vasudevachar, his senior Patnam Subramanya Iyer's disciple, Poochi Iyengar, all admired him.

So, his style was very difficult?

- very difficult .. all those great musicians of his own times, earlier and after, all musicians used to admire him like anything, they used to adore him like anything; unanimous opinion, no two opinions; at conferences, he was a wonderful exponent of music rather. In Music Academy conferences, when he used to discuss Ragas, Raga Sanchara, Raga Lakshana and all that, he used to give wonderful comments

He was a real musicologist?

- he was a musicologist not in the modern sense, nowadays I am sorry to say musicologists means simply writing books, but he was a musicologist in the true sense; he sang and explained things, his own inimitable way, there was sarcasam sometimes, there was humour but very subtle, his summation of things. In the Academy, it is a well known fact, he used to lead discussions for number of Ragas, Kapi, Manji, Kannada, Chakravaha … almost.. controversial things from the right beginning. In fact conferences were very uninteresting without him.

We gathered this information from various sources? Did he not have just one guru?

- His prominent guru was of course Patnam Subramanya Iyer, Patnam Subramanya Iyer was direct disciple of Manubuchavadi Venkata Subba Iyer, who was one of the direct disciples of Sri.Tyagaraja Swamy. So, my master is Tyagaraja Swamy's disciple's discilple and I am the fourth generation, so we belong to direct sishya parampara of Sri. Tyagaraja. But his master was a wonderful man, he was a composer too. Patnam Subramanya Iyer's varnas, kritis, javalis, they resemble very much like Tyagaraja's. of course, my master also imbibed many traits from his master, alongwith some traits of some other musicians also, conscious or otherwise, that is the beauty of things. Sometimes some qualities come to a musician unconsciously, we can't explain. I am told that it seems persons like T V Subba rao & Dhannamal, they used to say, His music had qualities of Coimbatore Raghava Iyer & Maha Vaidyanatha Iyer too, "sowka pancha trikala ". Coimbatore Raghava Iyer was a specialist in Chowka, Patnam Subramanya Iyer madhyama kala & Maha Vaidyanatha Iyer, trikala - higher speed, all these traits they used to visualize in his music. He used to say, I have never heard Coimbatore Raghava Iyer, I have faintly heard Maha Vaidyanatha Iyer, but my main structure is my Master, he used to say. But unconsciously things come too, mysteriously, it is a mysterious affair..(pauses)

Do you believe that it is possible for a musician to make a decent living as a musician in this profession?

- It's a very difficult question to answer, depends on his own private life, family incumburances and all that, because he might have a decent income, but it dosen't mean that it will be sufficient for his maintanences and all that, depends on so many other factors. Classical musicians usually can't be getting as much money as other allied artists get, for instance film musicians, I am sorry to say, comparatively, but he has to maintain a bit of status and decency , so usually as a profession, classical music at any time was not attractive, I should say, no musician to my knowledge became a 'lakhier', but at the same time, within the limits, a good musician had a very nice life, I should say, provided he had his outlook and approach to things properly, that's my version. There's no limit to status, income & outcome basis.

Do you believe artists are treated well by Indian Society?

- of course, artists are treated well. Regard & respect is there especially in these days, the musical education has spread, but the mystery attached to vidwans in those days is almost gone nowadays, because it has spread so much; there was a mystery about them, I am sorry to say, that is disturbed, because of the expansion and spread of communication, it has lost a bit of mystery, but, provided a musician can maintain the individuality, I think the mystery will always be there, because once a musician is able to build up integrity and individuality, it is there always, otherwise it will be normal. There are so many musicians, in the sense, they can sing also, as I am reminded a statement by one of the scholars, whom I don't remember exactly once quoted the famous Rabindranath Tagore's statement " All singing is not music, but music is something different", comes from the soul, something like that..All singing is not music, it is a very fine statement. A man can sing but it cannot be always music, there's a very subtle differentiation, that was the type which my Master had.

He had the Bhava..

- His music had the wonderful bhava, in fact there were so many suggestions other than what he actually expressed. The only simili I can give you is, if you go to the beach side, you are seeing the sea, but actually we know that we are seeing only one by infinite part of the sea. We are seeing only very small area.

Only what is near to us…

- yes, it is a very negligible space, but that space, it is able to suggest for us so much of variety and all that, that we are immersed in it. So also, when a musician sings, it is not simply the actual music that he produces, of course that is there, but there should be more suggestion about it. As the other day, our friend Parthasarathy was referring, there is more beauty and meaning in pauses which this MDR is creating in the Music. The pauses have more meaning than the music itself. Silence,

yes, the meaningful pauses

meaningful pauses, that should be the case. So that means there is something beyond music. There is something beyond what is actually expressed. That should be the criterion of a good art. Otherwise, perfectly, grammatically good music will be almost everywhere.

How would you say that the state of music is different or the same than it was, when you were a child? How did the state of music change?

- you mean, the type of music in concerts? Of course, when I was a child, say from the days I remember, 10 or 15 say, I listened to so many musicians from that time onwards, in those days, of course, apparently the number of concerts were very limited; facilities were less, even in Madras, a city like Madras, I should say, Sabhas in those days might have been very limited, when compared to these days. AIR and all these facilities have come naturally very much later. So, the facilities were less and the frequency was over a wider range. So, people could hear classical music then and there, with intervals, and now the pattern has changed, the concert pattern has also changed because in those days musicians used to sing for 4 hours and 5 hours because naturally when people had lesser chance, they sat for longer time, also the musicians.

They made the most of it.

- yes correct. So that way, it happened to be substantial perhaps. But, how musicians looked at music was merely a concert pattern and a form of profession. The educational aspect of music, the cultural aspect of art, is a development in these 2 -3 decades. That aspect was almost forgotten, I mean it was not prevalent or visible. Concert means it was a concert just to hear and enjoy, but later years it has changed, the people have taken a different turn, also musicians, with liberal education, with liberal approach and all that. Incidentally the frequency has also increased. Concerts and facilities, we are able to hear classical music through so many mediums, so that is the difficulty, sometimes people may get a bit satiated and institutions have also supplied us with a good number of musicians, so naturally, proportionately, the audience, when there were 10's of listeners those days, we have hundreds today and only there were few musicians, today we get at least dozens of musicians.so, proportion has changed. So, musicians, music students, music scholars, listeners and facilities, everything has improved, increased.

Do you think concerts are better nowadays?

- see, there also this question comes. In some sense it has improved, in some sense it has not, because one thing was very prominent, people used to devote much more time those days, in practice, Sadhana and the devotion they had, they used to work very hard. Because concert platform was their main view, of course natural inclination and mould was there, but naturally they didn't have any other vocation. Liberal education were all neglected, so they took up music from a very early age and they did nothing, but only music. There are still some musicians in their 60's who are present now, they did nothing practically except music. Now, music is part of life, it's almost part and parcel of life, cultural life. So, the status is different. So, concert and musician's function is much more different, and constructive, I should say, in those days mere enjoyment of music, now it is enjoyment with a purpose, purposeful enjoyment, meaningful enjoyment is the tone of our modern days, knowledgable, understandable enjoyment.